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How Italian-American Are You? What's the "Criteria"?

How Italian-American Are You? What's the "Criteria"?

Johnny Meatballs DeCarlo (November 10, 2013)

Formal Italian & "Goomba Italian"

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I recently shared a blog post from the website of a fellow popular Italian-American writer on my facebook wall which generated nearly 150 comments and a lot of controversy.


My initial reaction to this blog (which was her tutorial on how to pronounce a list of Italian words) was disgust, a sentiment echoed by many of my friends. I found the “tone” of the article to be a little condescending in nature. For example, it stated one is “wrong” if they pronounce “ricotta” as “ree-gawt” rather than the proper “re-caught-uh.”

 

To me, there is no right or wrong. How one Italian-American chooses to say a word is based on several factors including where one’s family traces their regional lineage in the Old Country, to where they were raised in America, as well as one’s social class and of course how “Italian” they consider themselves to be. I will explain those factors in specific but first I want to offer a public apology to the author with my “disgust” reaction, just as she apologized for de-friending me. We both had unfounded initial knee-jerk reactions and are friends again. It was never her intent to sound superior but was rather trying to convey a message on formal Italian language—which is perfectly OK.

 

It was never my intent to insult anyone, as a fellow blogger, I have dealt with a fair amount of folks dissecting my blogs—and have received constructive criticism on a lot of my entries which I have learned from as well as blatant hate speech from the “holier-than-thou” activists. I have always confronted those who have written to me head on, sometimes this has resulted in beneficial back and forth dialogue and other times it has gone nowhere. Some people just have their opinions and cannot respect the other side, can’t do anything about that. I’m glad to report that the author and I do respect each others sides at this time and there is no ill-will.

 

What’s very unfortunate is how the Italian-American heritage is so divided like no other nationality and my “disgust” reaction is really directed to the “activist” types who either a.) have totally made it a point to forgot their humble “goomba” roots or b.) do not have those roots and just can’t grasp the fact that there was/is such a sub-culture of Italian-Americana and only feel that promoting high-end stuff is acceptable. To those individuals, I say, get off your high horses. Unless you live in Italy, we are all AMERICANS and we all interpret the Italian culture in our own way.

 

To pronounce Italian words with a Jersey/Brooklyn-esque “slang” is the same as any other dialect spoken in Italy or anywhere else. I am fully aware that “cunn-oh-lee” is “proper” for cannoli but if I say “ga-nole” among my goombas like many others do within a certain group setting, how are we deemed as bad people? It might not be proper formal Italian but it’s still a very real vernacular. I have been studying this subject for the past 5 years and I am still intrigued with how many “haters” there are within our own nationality and a lot of it stems from extremism on both sides of the spectrum, just like in politics.

 

When millions of people see drunken, promiscuous, at times violent behavior displayed by young East Coast Italian-Americans on a reality show done under the shared label of being a proud “guido,” (a group which may share some of my speech patterns and a few other traits), the older, Renaissance art/opera music/formal language crowd tend to deem ALL those who do not practice their particular “cultured” way of living to be outcasts of the Italian-American nationality. What’s interesting is how that is their first reaction rather than simply taking someone as an individual. Maybe looking at their particular questionable hedonistic patterns and saying they are not necessarily displaying an overall wholesome selection of lifestyle choices as members of American society rather than members of a particular ethnicity would make more sense. But how is it their business anyway? Isn't this a free country?

 

To me that speaks of an inferiority complex which again, comes from either these activists trying to forget their roots or just a lack of understanding that anyone who drops the “a” from mozzarella is not automatically a party animal. I am not one to judge anyone else—however they may choose to live. Or speak. And as I will reiterate, no other ethnic groups seem to have these divisive problems. What’s ironic is that, although the abolishing of regional dialects in Italy is being promoted by modern professors, when I was there, I observed Italians saying “grazie” differently from region to region. I heard “grot-zee” and also the more theatrical “grot-zee-yeh.” It’s just different interpretations. We don’t all have to sound like Miss Giada De Laurentiis.

 

It’s all “toe-may-toe / toe-mott-oh” if you ask me. It’s great to be educated and to be aware of how a word is formally pronounced, but the way you speak does not reflect one’s intelligence level or how real of an “Italian” (or Croatian or Mexican or whatever) they are. I never heard two Greeks calling “Greekism” into question if one says “yee-dough” or “gy-row” for gyro. It is like the tired “gravy/sauce” thing. I have seen paisans ripping each other apart, engaging in horrible name-calling and anger over what the red stuff is “supposed” to be called...and then how much of an Italian you are depending on how “authentic” your recipe is. To me, it is just ridiculous! It should be celebrated that we are attempting to cook these dishes at all—for carrying on traditions—and if we say things differently or prepare them differently, so what???

 

 

As my good friend Peter stated:

It’s a discussion of apples and oranges. Both are fruits, but both are different...Words all have a specific and proper spelling and pronunciation. “Mispronounced” words are a loving homage to our great or great-great grandparents who came to the US on the big wave of immigration 1880-1930. Much of the Italian-American pronunciations are a blend of the old regional dialects with an immigrants attempt to speak their language in a new and different country. When certain countrymen in Italy speak together, the Italian they are speaking is almost indiscernible. Yet, they can switch into proper Italian in a heartbeat. Us Italian-Americans have a connection with calling a sfogliatelle a “s'fuyladell” and I don't apologize for that. Would you tell someone in Macon GA that they need to say “YOU ALL” instead of Y'ALL?? Or someone in Texas that they speak wrong because they say HOWDY instead of HELLO?? Or someone in New England the word is CAR not CAAHHH??

 

Here’s the thing, formal speech and slang/dialect speech are just different, it’s just not a matter of right or wrong. For a school lesson I understand teaching young kids proper words and terms but to dismiss a part of one’s own family history by discouraging ALL from continuing a pronunciation that has been done for centuries is neglecting a substantial sub-cultural aspect of Italian-Americana. My mother's first language was Italian, but my brother and I never learned the formal language just like a lot of second and third generations where I grew up. So we carved out our own little lingo and somewhere along the line because a few Italian-Americans chose to conduct themselves in an unflattering light while using some of that lingo we all then were suddenly disgraziato!

 

When looking at the entire context of Italian-Americana, speech is really not the number one defining factor. We speak more with our hands anyway! But in all seriousness, it is more about the ideals and attitudes we practice. Yes there are a lot of silly shared stereotypes—many of which are true, like how we dress, decorate our homes, style our hair and other superficial things. But our Italian-Americana is mainly about food, religion, the holiday traditions, our strong fondness for family, those values that we were raised with and want to pass down to our kids. The further removed we are with our ancestors, the more things evolve and the more things change—some for the good but a lot for the bad.

 

The “PC”/whitewashing nature of trying to strip individual expression will always bother me and I will never succumb to the idea that a heritage cannot be practiced and celebrated out of interpretation. That is why it is called being “ethnic.” And there is no textbook to follow. We follow our neighborhood upbringing and our friends and our own minds and most of all—our hearts. Our backbone is our background and only God should judge, and as long as I am alive I will be proud of where I'm from and how I speak.

 

Now go have a cannoli. Or ga-nole.


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Learn Italian

Johnny, did you graduate from High School? I'm asking because you can't construct an argument in the English language. In fact, it may help if you take a few Italian as a second language courses because you may do better with a new language. My favorite line above is how you and your friends carved out your own little language! Yes, it's called being illiterate and too lazy to put in the hard work to learn Italian.

Cugine Corner - The Johnny Meatballs Blog | i-ITALY

AK: I stuck very closely to the facts--mostly supplied by Zenger himself who took copious notes. December 14, 1947 the official opening of the "New Chamartín" marked the friendly match between the "Real" and the Portuguese club"Belenenses", which ended with the score 3-1 in favor of the Spanish team.

Day by day more families in the county lost their homes because of not paying their mortgages, and are in the obligation to take a rental.

Agree with the previous

Agree with the previous comment regarding language vs. dialect. What are referred to in Italy as "dialects" are all languages in their own right and their relation to Italian is the same as the relation of Spanish or French to Italian: they are all vulgates derived from Latin.

I also agree with you, the blogger, if you're main point is that we can pronounce words however we please and if there are enough people around us who understand, then all the better.

However, let's get something straight: there's no reason to stop learning. For most of us, IA, unless we grew up around speakers of the regional languages, then we will probably never be able to learn the language that our ancestor's spoke (even in Italy, since those regional languages, like any living thing, have changed over time), but that's no reason not to the language the Italian nation chose for its national language. Nor, is it a reason to not explore our heritage in this country, as well as the way this NY/NJ "dialect" developed... I actually cringe a bit when people think that they are speaking Neapolitan, when they are not... this local "dialect" that we have here has none of the cadence, rhythm, or actual sound present in any Italian regional language. It is thoroughly American, sort of like a game of telephone where the first speaker said the Neapolitan word and when it finely got to you, out came the New York dialect.

Anyway, you may want to look at H.L. Mencken's book from the 1920s, The American Language, which devotes considerable space to the language of Italian immigrants and the creation of Italglish.

Finally, there's a wide chasm between "the cultured way" and the reality show you refer to. That is to say, they are two complete extremes. Our heritage as Italian Americans lies somewhere in the middle. It is a shame that so few of us take the time to seriously explore it. Instead, we are drawn to the invented extremes: the Renaissance or the Jersey Shore. Both would have our ancestors turning in their graves, I assure you.

Dialect vs. Formal Italian

I agree with a lot of what you say. I'd also like to add that those in Italy today tend to look down upon anyone who speaks his regional "dialect" as opposed to "formal" Italian. I put these words in quotes because they are actually very inaccurate. None of the languages spoken throughout the regions of Italy are dialects of the Italian language, but in fact, are all naturally developed languages from Latin, including what is known as "formal" Italian. "Formal" Italian is just the dialect used by Dante from Tuscany that, due to the popularity and poetic style of his work, was simply decided by the powers that be to be used as the one Italian that should be taught in schools. It has no more historic claim to be considered "true" Italian than Siciliano, Napolitano, or any other so-called "dialect". Had Sicilian been chosen, then that would be called "formal Italian" and everything else would be named "dialect". What's happened over the past couple generations is that now the youth are losing the Italian language of their ancestors and adopting the Tuscan dialect only. This is a shame because it is killing their identity and history and actually creating somewhat of a class divide. Those who were educated well in more "formal" Italian look down upon those who still use the language of their ancestors and region. These regional "dialects" therefore, are considered second class languages and are endangered. If something isn't done, they will die out in a few more generations. You can easily make the case that there is an east coast Italian dialect in the U.S. also. It's not wrong, it's just a different evolution of the language, and language is always evolving. Just ask any English speaker trying to read Shakespeare. Having a language that can be traced to a place is part of one's identity and history and something to be proud of, not ashamed. It is just a crime, however, that a language die out because of arrogance towards it from those who claim their version is "right" and others' is "wrong". That is exactly what is happening in Italy today unless the view and treatment of the "dialects" changes.